Stephane Clavel
olivier REMUX wrote :
A decent PC laptop with a good RTX (so not a 2050 or 3050) will start around $900, same as a macbook air, but will be MUCH faster than the macbook air for AI.yes, actually only M1 M2 M3 can do great stems without FAN GPU external GPU or PC gamer. and for less money than a Windows PC gamer.
Just saying...
Mensajes Thu 23 May 24 @ 6:34 pm
olivier REMUX
Stephane Clavel wrote :
Just saying...
olivier REMUX wrote :
A decent PC laptop with a good RTX (so not a 2050 or 3050) will start around $900, same as a macbook air, but will be MUCH faster than the macbook air for AI.yes, actually only M1 M2 M3 can do great stems without FAN GPU external GPU or PC gamer. and for less money than a Windows PC gamer.
Just saying...
However, the MAC doesn't need an additional GPU :) all is on M1/M2/M3/M4 and have better energy management. don't need RTX or other... more simple
More robust and
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 7:34 am
locoDog
same money and slower for stems, you're not really selling it olivier.
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 8:15 am
kradcliffe
I've tried Macs several times over the years, last time being a M2 Max. It ran stems at 23.5% speed however I now have a RTX4080 laptop that was cheaper than the mac and runs them at 41x.
They are slower than RTX and there are a host of issues with MacOS I couldn't live with. Multiple monitor support for one is dreadful.
As someone who has used PCs for DJ work since 1999, I would always use Windows over Mac for so many reasons.
They are slower than RTX and there are a host of issues with MacOS I couldn't live with. Multiple monitor support for one is dreadful.
As someone who has used PCs for DJ work since 1999, I would always use Windows over Mac for so many reasons.
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 8:47 am
DJ VinylTouch
kradcliffe wrote :
Multiple monitor support for one is dreadful.
Multiple monitor support for one is dreadful.
Unless you are using like 3 or more monitors I thought multi-monitor is pretty decent in the MacOS world. They did regress on this when they initially introduced the arm-based M-series Macs (it only really supported maximum 1 external monitor) but from M2 Pro onwards it supports up to two monitors just as before.
kradcliffe wrote :
...there are a host of issues with MacOS I couldn't live with.
...
As someone who has used PCs for DJ work since 1999, I would always use Windows over Mac for so many reasons.
...there are a host of issues with MacOS I couldn't live with.
...
As someone who has used PCs for DJ work since 1999, I would always use Windows over Mac for so many reasons.
It would be nice if you elaborated on this. Tbh I've used both platforms for DJing over the years, and I found there could be far more work in getting the Windows machine working correctly - choosing the right machine with specs (archictecture and other low levels being considered), decluttering of unnecessary apps, power management and other OS level optimizations, required additional drivers for pretty much all controllers. In the Mac world, the average machine (in at least the last 10-15 years especially) pretty much works out of the box with almost no thought on these considerations. I know Windows systems can be tuned more precisely to work even better than Macs, but that's extra time that most DJs would most likely want to spend elsewhere.
(I'm also a bit biased to UNIX systems, since that is what I live in for development).
I do appreciate both platforms - they both can get the job done.
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 11:32 am
groovindj
To all: Please don't turn this into a Mac vs PC thread.
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 12:14 pm
PhantomDeejay
I don't know if I want to set this thread on fire (and then lock it) or not.
However, I will throw this into the mix:
"Try to connect and use a touch screen to a MAC"
Also,
That's as far from reality as it gets. Because in the last 10 years almost ALL controllers require their special MAC OS drivers to work.
Also during some transition phases of MAC OS the last years, the driver should be different, the exact same way that in Windows there's a different driver for Win XP, different for Win 7, and different for Win 8 onwards - for devices that support that many OS versions.
My point is NOT to start a PC vs MAC debate, nor to set the thread on fire.
However MACs DO HAVE their weaknesses too. They are NOT the "perfect" solution some users claim them to be.
I have nothing against MACs. I use both platforms, and I recognize that BOTH have their weak and strong points. :)
However, I will throw this into the mix:
"Try to connect and use a touch screen to a MAC"
Also,
DJ VinylTouch wrote :
I've used both platforms for DJing over the years, and I found there could be far more work in getting the Windows machine working correctly ... required additional drivers for pretty much all controllers. In the Mac world, the average machine (in at least the last 10-15 years especially) pretty much works out of the box with almost no thought on these considerations.
That's as far from reality as it gets. Because in the last 10 years almost ALL controllers require their special MAC OS drivers to work.
Also during some transition phases of MAC OS the last years, the driver should be different, the exact same way that in Windows there's a different driver for Win XP, different for Win 7, and different for Win 8 onwards - for devices that support that many OS versions.
My point is NOT to start a PC vs MAC debate, nor to set the thread on fire.
However MACs DO HAVE their weaknesses too. They are NOT the "perfect" solution some users claim them to be.
I have nothing against MACs. I use both platforms, and I recognize that BOTH have their weak and strong points. :)
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 1:25 pm
DJ VinylTouch
PhantomDeejay wrote :
That's as far from reality as it gets. Because in the last 10 years almost ALL controllers require their special MAC OS drivers to work.
That's as far from reality as it gets. Because in the last 10 years almost ALL controllers require their special MAC OS drivers to work.
It's not really a severe stretch of the truth, but just maybe not worded in the best way....I'm bringing the focus not only to the actual software required to interface with the hardware but what an end user has to do to get that software on the machine to start working with the hardware.
I live mostly in the battle mixer world - from the perspective of the device user and firmware updates aside, besides a DJM S9 and DJM S11 (which requires the user to explicitly install drivers across the board), I've owned the Kontrol Z2 and used a Rane Seventy Two and Reloop Elite - besides perhaps sometime their configuration software (which I guess could be argued is a device driver install in a sense), I don't remember having an explicit driver install for any of those. On Windows (via friends) that wasn't the case - there potentially was such an install required for all cases.
PhantomDeejay wrote :
Also during some transition phases of MAC OS the last years, the driver should be different, the exact same way that in Windows there's a different driver for Win XP, different for Win 7, and different for Win 8 onwards - for devices that support that many OS versions.
Also during some transition phases of MAC OS the last years, the driver should be different, the exact same way that in Windows there's a different driver for Win XP, different for Win 7, and different for Win 8 onwards - for devices that support that many OS versions.
This is true, however t I haven't noticed that for at least the last 3 releases or so for my S9.
With respect to touch screen usage, that feels useful but very niche (I could be wrong)...I don't really have friends who are DJs who are big in that, but that is just my circle.
I actually have nothing against Windows at all...I use it daily too... it's just from what I've experienced (personally), there were more variables to take into account before having a machine ready for the job, but you got that worked out (with whatever tweaks required), it works very very well, equal to or even better than a Mac.
I'm just pointing out that the end experience/ergonomics matters as much as the capabilities, especially when you are catering to customers who most likely aren't as tech savvy.
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 2:34 pm
kradcliffe
So back to topic. Will these mobile chips (which are the equivalent of M1, M2 etc.) be supported by VDJ as they are going on sale now?
Mensajes Mon 17 Jun 24 @ 2:55 pm
kradcliffe
Mensajes Thu 27 Jun 24 @ 9:10 am
kradcliffe
Any news on this?
Obviously there may be issues with legacy controller drivers but what about VDJ itself since these units are now on sale.
Simple yes/no will do :)
Obviously there may be issues with legacy controller drivers but what about VDJ itself since these units are now on sale.
Simple yes/no will do :)
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 10:08 am
groovindj
I'd speculate that it won't just be issues with legacy drivers...
Serato have a statement up on their site, saying that their software is not compatible, and that there's no time frame for when they "may" support ARM.
No statement from AlphaPioneerTheta, Denon DJ or Native Instruments that I can find, so IMO if they're not releasing software that supports ARM, it's doubtful that they'll release drivers.
Serato have a statement up on their site, saying that their software is not compatible, and that there's no time frame for when they "may" support ARM.
No statement from AlphaPioneerTheta, Denon DJ or Native Instruments that I can find, so IMO if they're not releasing software that supports ARM, it's doubtful that they'll release drivers.
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 10:52 am
kradcliffe
So why are Microsoft and other vendors putting these things on the shelves and in MS case ditching Intel altogether then?
The assumption was that the implementation would be similar to Apple M series chips and an emulation layer that just works.
The assumption was that the implementation would be similar to Apple M series chips and an emulation layer that just works.
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 11:06 am
groovindj
Ditching Intel? What's your source for that claim?
Doesn't seem to be the case here:
https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/21/24079336/microsoft-intel-chip-partnership-foundry-tsmc
Microsoft have a history of trying something new, which then fails (i.e. Zune).
Doesn't seem to be the case here:
https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/21/24079336/microsoft-intel-chip-partnership-foundry-tsmc
Microsoft have a history of trying something new, which then fails (i.e. Zune).
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 11:17 am
kradcliffe
I meant for the Surface Pro. It's always been Intel but isn't this year.
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 11:29 am
groovindj
I think this is similar to those who buy a new controller as soon as it hits the market, then ask Atomix why it's not supported yet, or when it will be.
....or people asking when there will be a Linux version of VDJ, or an Android version.
Better to wait and see - if the product actually starts to take off, or flops dramatically.
Algoriddim have jumped in because they're a small fish and want a bigger slice of the pie (to mix metaphors) but it seems others are sitting back with their popcorn and waiting to see what happens.
....or people asking when there will be a Linux version of VDJ, or an Android version.
Better to wait and see - if the product actually starts to take off, or flops dramatically.
Algoriddim have jumped in because they're a small fish and want a bigger slice of the pie (to mix metaphors) but it seems others are sitting back with their popcorn and waiting to see what happens.
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 11:36 am
kradcliffe
I understand that, but it was just a simple question to the dev team to ask if they are considering support or not at this point in time.
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 11:43 am
Adion
I can confirm that the 64-bit version of VirtualDJ works fine on the Snapdragon X.
Stems are processed on the CPU, so a bit slow at 1.8x but otherwise it seems ok.
We are indeed working on an optimized ARM build, but no ETA at this point
Stems are processed on the CPU, so a bit slow at 1.8x but otherwise it seems ok.
We are indeed working on an optimized ARM build, but no ETA at this point
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 12:03 pm
kradcliffe
Exactly the reply I was after. Thank you Adion.
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 12:42 pm
DJ VinylTouch
groovindj wrote :
Algoriddim have jumped in because they're a small fish and want a bigger slice of the pie (to mix metaphors) but it seems others are sitting back with their popcorn and waiting to see what happens.
Algoriddim have jumped in because they're a small fish and want a bigger slice of the pie (to mix metaphors) but it seems others are sitting back with their popcorn and waiting to see what happens.
They've jumped in because the SoC now includes a dedicated AI processor onboard, allowing them to do more AI based things better (stem separation and beyond), while still in a relatively small form factor (running on mobile devices is one of the niches they are trying to differentiate with), and also potentially not being restricted by OS limitations like in the case of iOS, where custom driver installation isn't an option (and that eliminates a fair chunk of DJ hardware from fully functioning correctly there).
Mensajes Wed 17 Jul 24 @ 1:21 pm
