ElofdeNeve
I've asked/posted it before here (some months ago): some MP3's are showing up wrongly. The beats are not divided correctly. So when you try to beatmix it sounds wrong. The beats are not together but kinda ... fluctuate (or how do I call that?).
I use only legal MP3's, but of course sometimes I download a track just to hear it (hey, I'm no Saint you know). BUT: if the tracks appeals to me I always buy the vinyl version!!!
It came to my attention that these downloaded files usually give problems with beats. Problems due to illegal stuff I assumed.
Anyway, yesterday I came to a disturbing problem: I buy official MP3's of new music at Beatport. So far, all music worked fine, untill ... I bought Lee Cabrera feat. Phase 2 - Voodoo love. When I uploaded the track in Virtual DJ the beats were indicated incorrectly. I tried to adjust by setting the 'phase' correctly with the first beats, but nope.. that didn't work, after a few seconds the beats kinda fluctuated.
Mixing the song is impossible.
Beatport is an official MP3 selling company. So I'm pretty sure that they rip/encode their MP3's directly from CD-R from the record companies. They encode in 192 kbps.
What could be the problem? Perhaps it is the track that is wrongly made? I have also the vinyl version and mixing that worked just fine for me.
I use only legal MP3's, but of course sometimes I download a track just to hear it (hey, I'm no Saint you know). BUT: if the tracks appeals to me I always buy the vinyl version!!!
It came to my attention that these downloaded files usually give problems with beats. Problems due to illegal stuff I assumed.
Anyway, yesterday I came to a disturbing problem: I buy official MP3's of new music at Beatport. So far, all music worked fine, untill ... I bought Lee Cabrera feat. Phase 2 - Voodoo love. When I uploaded the track in Virtual DJ the beats were indicated incorrectly. I tried to adjust by setting the 'phase' correctly with the first beats, but nope.. that didn't work, after a few seconds the beats kinda fluctuated.
Mixing the song is impossible.
Beatport is an official MP3 selling company. So I'm pretty sure that they rip/encode their MP3's directly from CD-R from the record companies. They encode in 192 kbps.
What could be the problem? Perhaps it is the track that is wrongly made? I have also the vinyl version and mixing that worked just fine for me.
Mensajes Tue 13 Jul 04 @ 7:28 am
djzero
vdj doesn't generate the correct BPM for all songs. have you read the posts about the mix master bpm calculator and the program designed to import the BPMs. this will save you the time of manually working out the bpm.
it is not that the songs are not coppied directly from cds it is the fact that they have an irregulat beat and the VDJ beat calculation algorithm needs some work for styles with irregular beats (ie. r&b, hip hop, jungle...)
read the topic and download the little apps. it will make the program alot more usable
the link to the discussion is
http://www.virtualdj.com/forum/display.html?topic=5369
it is not that the songs are not coppied directly from cds it is the fact that they have an irregulat beat and the VDJ beat calculation algorithm needs some work for styles with irregular beats (ie. r&b, hip hop, jungle...)
read the topic and download the little apps. it will make the program alot more usable
the link to the discussion is
http://www.virtualdj.com/forum/display.html?topic=5369
Mensajes Tue 13 Jul 04 @ 1:24 pm
macourteau
Here is another topic much shorter, that says pretty much the same thing ;)
http://www.virtualdj.com/forum/display.html?topic=5649
macourteau
http://www.virtualdj.com/forum/display.html?topic=5649
macourteau
Mensajes Tue 13 Jul 04 @ 2:13 pm
Superstom
I agree that the beat counter of VDJ calulates the BPM not always correct.
VDJ calculates just one BPM for the complete track. For house, dance, trance this is ok, but I have lots of dance classics. The trouble here is that those songs have different BPM's in the same song. In some songs the chorus part of the song is faster than verses. Most of the songs are drummed by hand and now and then the drummer got tired, resulting in a decrease of the BPM. This is not handled because VDJ has one (avarage?) BPM.
My Pioneer mixer does a real time calculation and does the job quite well
I will post a in the new feature forum, that a real time calculation could be chosen in the configuration, or set up per song
Ewout
VDJ calculates just one BPM for the complete track. For house, dance, trance this is ok, but I have lots of dance classics. The trouble here is that those songs have different BPM's in the same song. In some songs the chorus part of the song is faster than verses. Most of the songs are drummed by hand and now and then the drummer got tired, resulting in a decrease of the BPM. This is not handled because VDJ has one (avarage?) BPM.
My Pioneer mixer does a real time calculation and does the job quite well
I will post a in the new feature forum, that a real time calculation could be chosen in the configuration, or set up per song
Ewout
Mensajes Tue 13 Jul 04 @ 9:11 pm
ElofdeNeve
Tonight I came to another official downloaded song that got it's BPM good in the beginning of the song. In the song there is a part that uplifts the beats for a few seconds until a small break. After that break, the BPM is complete incorrect. So mixing with the beatlock is impossible at that time.
Maybe it is possible for Atomix to make a 'constant recount BPM' feature?
Maybe it is possible for Atomix to make a 'constant recount BPM' feature?
Mensajes Tue 13 Jul 04 @ 9:36 pm
apopsisdj
Djelof, you wrote :
The beats are not together but kinda ... fluctuate (or how do I call that?).
Please take a look what i wrote to this post about "fluctuate"
and let me know if you agree.
http://www.virtualdj.com/forum/display.html?topic=5592
George.
The beats are not together but kinda ... fluctuate (or how do I call that?).
Please take a look what i wrote to this post about "fluctuate"
and let me know if you agree.
http://www.virtualdj.com/forum/display.html?topic=5592
George.
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 3:14 pm
ElofdeNeve
Thanks for your help! I know about time stretching. I never use that. Disabled from the first moment I had the program (some months ago).
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 3:19 pm
ElofdeNeve
Maybe you can download the track from Lee Cabrera presents Phase 2 -Love voodoo?
It's only 1.49 dollar at www.beatport.com
Upload it in your virtual dj and look at the beat indication. Impossible to mix, even with changing the phase of the song.
Or a better exemple, a track that is good untill the break at the end of the song, and then virtual dj looses the beat.
www.sms4music.com > gepetto - pinnochio (Redshark vs Gepetto mix)
(i know, it is a rubbish song, but one person asked me to spin it at a small party, so I bought the song - sometimes a dj has to make sacrifices *grin*)
It's only 1.49 dollar at www.beatport.com
Upload it in your virtual dj and look at the beat indication. Impossible to mix, even with changing the phase of the song.
Or a better exemple, a track that is good untill the break at the end of the song, and then virtual dj looses the beat.
www.sms4music.com > gepetto - pinnochio (Redshark vs Gepetto mix)
(i know, it is a rubbish song, but one person asked me to spin it at a small party, so I bought the song - sometimes a dj has to make sacrifices *grin*)
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 3:23 pm
apopsisdj
Another reason i can think but i didn't try it myself,
is how the mp3's are encoded.
I think that the vbr encoded files have this problem,
when mixing (must read this somewhere), not the cbr.
Please check the mp3's you have problem with.
An easy way to check is to load them in winamp and press Alt+3 (for file info)
Let me know.
is how the mp3's are encoded.
I think that the vbr encoded files have this problem,
when mixing (must read this somewhere), not the cbr.
Please check the mp3's you have problem with.
An easy way to check is to load them in winamp and press Alt+3 (for file info)
Let me know.
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 3:28 pm
macourteau
Wether it's VBR or CBR doesn't change the way BPM's are calculated: the song is first decoded to a PCM signal (a WAV signal), and then the beats are calculated... so the encoding of the song doesn't change anything. The thing is that is's hard for a software to calculate something so abstract as beats... :)
macourteau
macourteau
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 3:41 pm
apopsisdj
Yes i know that, but you see mp3 is not a "loseless"
compression, if something changes in sound quality and the "timing" of a song during the encode process, decode
the mp3 to pcm/wav again will not reproduce the original
wav file in any way.
That's the reason i always recommend never to convert
files from one loseless format to another, or edit mp3's
using a wave editor like wavelab or soundforge.
(encoding 2 times, this doubles the loose in quality)
compression, if something changes in sound quality and the "timing" of a song during the encode process, decode
the mp3 to pcm/wav again will not reproduce the original
wav file in any way.
That's the reason i always recommend never to convert
files from one loseless format to another, or edit mp3's
using a wave editor like wavelab or soundforge.
(encoding 2 times, this doubles the loose in quality)
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 3:58 pm
macourteau
Yes that's true, but the timing is not altered enough to make VDJ get the BPM's wrong. Of course mp3 is a lossy algorithm, but it still gives an excellent quality if encoded at 192kbps or higher...
I use lame with "-q 0 -b 192" when encoding, and I can barely see the difference between the wave file and the mp3 file (most of the time I see no difference at all). Whenever I edit a file, I export it to wave, and then I encode it because lame gives such a good quality; but that's only my opinion :)
macourteau
I use lame with "-q 0 -b 192" when encoding, and I can barely see the difference between the wave file and the mp3 file (most of the time I see no difference at all). Whenever I edit a file, I export it to wave, and then I encode it because lame gives such a good quality; but that's only my opinion :)
macourteau
Mensajes Wed 14 Jul 04 @ 4:08 pm
apopsisdj
I agree, Lame is very good, i use it too at 192, and best
quality. But i always avoid to edit and re-encode files.
For this i use other mp3 utilities like mp3trim (trim and gain
directly to mp3 without re-encode ..!)
Djelof, i just tried Lee Cabrera Phase 2 -Love voodoo,
and yes you have right, its impossible to mix using beatlock,
(using console version) but it is not the only one.
I've seen many, or maybe i'd say most of my songs are not
safe to mix using beatlock. (I spin many differrent styles,
from R&B to Ethnic).
Thats why i never use beatlock, like Ewout said it does
"strange" things. Instead try right click on the beatlock button
and see what happen..., or use a shortcut (i use the "numlock" key for that)
quality. But i always avoid to edit and re-encode files.
For this i use other mp3 utilities like mp3trim (trim and gain
directly to mp3 without re-encode ..!)
Djelof, i just tried Lee Cabrera Phase 2 -Love voodoo,
and yes you have right, its impossible to mix using beatlock,
(using console version) but it is not the only one.
I've seen many, or maybe i'd say most of my songs are not
safe to mix using beatlock. (I spin many differrent styles,
from R&B to Ethnic).
Thats why i never use beatlock, like Ewout said it does
"strange" things. Instead try right click on the beatlock button
and see what happen..., or use a shortcut (i use the "numlock" key for that)
Mensajes Thu 15 Jul 04 @ 12:02 pm
discotronic
you can make your files sound better with a wave-editor.you have to remaster them to get better quality afterwards.lot`s of work.i do it only with trax witch are hard to get!!!
Mensajes Thu 15 Jul 04 @ 12:21 pm