cj-jan
Hi VDJ Team,
recently I got a huge issue with clipping on my Pioneer DDJ-1000 SRT using VDJ.
It's just with some Songs, not all do clip, but when the issue is reproducable.
First I thought it depends with the autoGain feature.
In older versions of VDJ I thought there was a Option of the volume / level of the autoGain?
Turning off the autoGain eliminates clipping, but this feature seems now to work together with ther zeroDB value.
While turning on autoGain I had to reduce the zeroDB value to -9 kills the clipping on the DDJ-1000 SRT.
All other values higher will clip on certain songs.
Refering to the DDJ-1000 SRT, I've also tried Serato with different Autogain values in Serato (-98 dB as max).
Using the same Songs, there is no clipping in Serato.
I've tried other ASIO soundcards from e.g. Yamaha in VDJ - there was no clipping in VDJ with all zeroDB values or the autoGain at all.
It's just with the DDJ-1000 SRT.
So what's the Issue here?
Is it an DJJ-1000 SRT hardware topic, a Pioneer driver topic, VDJ zeroDB or VDJ autoGain?
Can anybody try to reproduce this issue using the same audio sources?
Acutal VDJ Version V8.5-64 b6017 on Win10 V1909 Build 18363.959
recently I got a huge issue with clipping on my Pioneer DDJ-1000 SRT using VDJ.
It's just with some Songs, not all do clip, but when the issue is reproducable.
First I thought it depends with the autoGain feature.
In older versions of VDJ I thought there was a Option of the volume / level of the autoGain?
Turning off the autoGain eliminates clipping, but this feature seems now to work together with ther zeroDB value.
While turning on autoGain I had to reduce the zeroDB value to -9 kills the clipping on the DDJ-1000 SRT.
All other values higher will clip on certain songs.
Refering to the DDJ-1000 SRT, I've also tried Serato with different Autogain values in Serato (-98 dB as max).
Using the same Songs, there is no clipping in Serato.
I've tried other ASIO soundcards from e.g. Yamaha in VDJ - there was no clipping in VDJ with all zeroDB values or the autoGain at all.
It's just with the DDJ-1000 SRT.
So what's the Issue here?
Is it an DJJ-1000 SRT hardware topic, a Pioneer driver topic, VDJ zeroDB or VDJ autoGain?
Can anybody try to reproduce this issue using the same audio sources?
Acutal VDJ Version V8.5-64 b6017 on Win10 V1909 Build 18363.959
Mensajes Wed 22 Jul 20 @ 5:20 pm
cj-jan
I've also tired different setting on the Pioneer DDJ-1000 SRT itself.
Reducing Mater ATT to -6 dB, also turn on/off the Master Limiter on the Device does not effect the clipping issue.
It seems that its made by VDJ.
Reducing Mater ATT to -6 dB, also turn on/off the Master Limiter on the Device does not effect the clipping issue.
It seems that its made by VDJ.
Mensajes Wed 22 Jul 20 @ 5:43 pm
groovindj
You keep saying it's clipping - but what's actually happening?
Are you hearing distortion, seeing the VU meters reach maximum? Both?
Are you hearing distortion, seeing the VU meters reach maximum? Both?
Mensajes Wed 22 Jul 20 @ 5:46 pm
PhantomDeejay
Please take a moment to realize how this controller handles audio:
VirtualDJ (or Serato) feeds each deck with the sound of the track played.
Then the unit applies it's own gain adjustment and mixing, and then it outputs that sound
So, the software is responsible only for the sound of deck that sends to the controller.
On our tests here, we did not had distortion issues even with zerodb setting to "default"
However, yes you can lower the overal output of VirtualDJ to the controller by using another zerodb value like -6db or -9db
After the sound reaches the controller, the controller itself is responsible for applying gain. Also it's vu-meters are hardware operated and therefore you should use them to calibrate your gain settings
Generally speaking your vu-meters should barely hit the amber zone and never the red zone.
If you lower the deck output of the software but you use gain to increase the volume to high levels you won't really achieve anything.
PS: VirtualDJ has a built-in limiter. This means that under no circumstances the sound leaving from VirtualDJ to controller can distort/clip. It can be compressed under some cases, yes, but not clipped. Therefore the clipping occurs on hardware level from your controller processing.
PS2: I don't remember about Serato, but for Rekordbox (and any controller made for it) Pioneer uses 9db headroom. Usually this headroom is handled by device definition and users don't need to do something. I'm just letting you know though...
VirtualDJ (or Serato) feeds each deck with the sound of the track played.
Then the unit applies it's own gain adjustment and mixing, and then it outputs that sound
So, the software is responsible only for the sound of deck that sends to the controller.
On our tests here, we did not had distortion issues even with zerodb setting to "default"
However, yes you can lower the overal output of VirtualDJ to the controller by using another zerodb value like -6db or -9db
After the sound reaches the controller, the controller itself is responsible for applying gain. Also it's vu-meters are hardware operated and therefore you should use them to calibrate your gain settings
Generally speaking your vu-meters should barely hit the amber zone and never the red zone.
If you lower the deck output of the software but you use gain to increase the volume to high levels you won't really achieve anything.
PS: VirtualDJ has a built-in limiter. This means that under no circumstances the sound leaving from VirtualDJ to controller can distort/clip. It can be compressed under some cases, yes, but not clipped. Therefore the clipping occurs on hardware level from your controller processing.
PS2: I don't remember about Serato, but for Rekordbox (and any controller made for it) Pioneer uses 9db headroom. Usually this headroom is handled by device definition and users don't need to do something. I'm just letting you know though...
Mensajes Wed 22 Jul 20 @ 7:17 pm
cj-jan
groovindj wrote :
You keep saying it's clipping - but what's actually happening?
Are you hearing distortion, seeing the VU meters reach maximum? Both?
Are you hearing distortion, seeing the VU meters reach maximum? Both?
Its a clipping sound, comes directly from VDJ in the channel on the DDJ-1000 and it's not related to the hardware gain knob on the device.
PhantomDeejay wrote :
Please take a moment to realize how this controller handles audio:
VirtualDJ (or Serato) feeds each deck with the sound of the track played.
Then the unit applies it's own gain adjustment and mixing, and then it outputs that sound
So, the software is responsible only for the sound of deck that sends to the controller.
On our tests here, we did not had distortion issues even with zerodb setting to "default"
However, yes you can lower the overal output of VirtualDJ to the controller by using another zerodb value like -6db or -9db
After the sound reaches the controller, the controller itself is responsible for applying gain. Also it's vu-meters are hardware operated and therefore you should use them to calibrate your gain settings
Generally speaking your vu-meters should barely hit the amber zone and never the red zone.
If you lower the deck output of the software but you use gain to increase the volume to high levels you won't really achieve anything.
VirtualDJ (or Serato) feeds each deck with the sound of the track played.
Then the unit applies it's own gain adjustment and mixing, and then it outputs that sound
So, the software is responsible only for the sound of deck that sends to the controller.
On our tests here, we did not had distortion issues even with zerodb setting to "default"
However, yes you can lower the overal output of VirtualDJ to the controller by using another zerodb value like -6db or -9db
After the sound reaches the controller, the controller itself is responsible for applying gain. Also it's vu-meters are hardware operated and therefore you should use them to calibrate your gain settings
Generally speaking your vu-meters should barely hit the amber zone and never the red zone.
If you lower the deck output of the software but you use gain to increase the volume to high levels you won't really achieve anything.
You are right, this is how the DDJ-1000 works, but the sound comes already distorted from VDJ, it's just on certain songs.
The VU-meter is not even in the first orange light, everything is green on the VU-neter.
I can turn down the channel gain and it's still clipping.
PhantomDeejay wrote :
PS: VirtualDJ has a built-in limiter. This means that under no circumstances the sound leaving from VirtualDJ to controller can distort/clip. It can be compressed under some cases, yes, but not clipped. Therefore the clipping occurs on hardware level from your controller processing.
PS: VirtualDJ has a built-in limiter. This means that under no circumstances the sound leaving from VirtualDJ to controller can distort/clip. It can be compressed under some cases, yes, but not clipped. Therefore the clipping occurs on hardware level from your controller processing.
Is there any option available in VDJ to test different settings on the limiter?
It's kind wierd, because it's only the DDJ-1000 SRT, any other soundcard I've tried in ASIO or WASAPI does not clip with the same settings.
PhantomDeejay wrote :
PS2: I don't remember about Serato, but for Rekordbox (and any controller made for it) Pioneer uses 9db headroom. Usually this headroom is handled by device definition and users don't need to do something. I'm just letting you know though...
PS2: I don't remember about Serato, but for Rekordbox (and any controller made for it) Pioneer uses 9db headroom. Usually this headroom is handled by device definition and users don't need to do something. I'm just letting you know though...
Thats a good information! As I wrote some MIDI device information by myself in earlier days of VDJ, is it possible to edit the factory device definitions of VDJ?
The clipping is just on certain songs which are not well leveled/mastered, if anyone is able to reproduce the issue on the DDJ-1000 SRT here are two songs on which i hear instantly clipping on my DDJ-1000 SRT with Virtual DJ.
1. Khruangbin - Time (You and I)
2. Shaggy - Mr. Boombastic (Sting Remix)
I've tried both songs in different formats WAV, FLAC and MP3 (320).
Mensajes Fri 24 Jul 20 @ 11:54 am
groovindj
It would be useful if you could record this clipping sound and post a link to it.
It would also help to allow Atomix staff access to those two tracks - your own copies. Not knowing where you got them, if they downloaded the tracks from somewhere else they may not be identical to yours.
You say you tried the same tracks in other formats - did you just convert the same files from format to format, or buy each track again?
It would also help to allow Atomix staff access to those two tracks - your own copies. Not knowing where you got them, if they downloaded the tracks from somewhere else they may not be identical to yours.
You say you tried the same tracks in other formats - did you just convert the same files from format to format, or buy each track again?
Mensajes Fri 24 Jul 20 @ 12:07 pm
cj-jan
Hi Guys,
thanks alot for your help.
I had a try with my wife's computer, made a clean install of VDJ and drivers - no clipping.
So i checked all configs I made over the years and deleted alot of global variables i used years ago with the DDJ-RR.
A config reset and new install of VDJ now did the job, semms like everything works now fine as it ment to be!
I'm very glad that VDJ community and staff is taking every request seriously!
This topic can now be closed.
thanks alot for your help.
I had a try with my wife's computer, made a clean install of VDJ and drivers - no clipping.
So i checked all configs I made over the years and deleted alot of global variables i used years ago with the DDJ-RR.
A config reset and new install of VDJ now did the job, semms like everything works now fine as it ment to be!
I'm very glad that VDJ community and staff is taking every request seriously!
This topic can now be closed.
Mensajes Fri 24 Jul 20 @ 2:12 pm